Author Topic: Do you have to degree a new cam ?  (Read 174327 times)

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Online Fitzy1980

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Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« on: February 17, 2016, 10:39:54 AM »
Hey all,

Pretty self explanatory.

Is it necessary to degree a new cam, or is it dependent on engine specs, use etc ?

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2016, 11:17:11 AM »
.
No, it will still run decent even if it is off a degree or two from the mfg's recommendation . Also, a cam from a quality company will be correct, however, which companies are these? . Irregardless, it certainly won't hurt.


Offline trav68

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2016, 11:18:16 AM »
No, you can install it "dot to dot". This is based on timing marks on the timing chain which is doweled to camshaft and keyed to crank. Hence, you will have some cumulative error from camshift grinding as well as timing chain assuming the camshaft is ground accurately which it most likely is if it is a COMP, Lunati etc etc

Degreeing a cam allows you to check the valve timing events against the cam card (as a double check it is ground and packaged correctly) and adjust for any timing issues depending on what timing chain you have purchased.

To degreee you will need a degree wheel, spare lifter, dial gauge and old wire to fashion a pointer. . I have never really timed the operation but all going well an hour should cover it.

I do it for all my builds but upto the individual and there is a difference between something you have injected 10k worth of parts and machining into versus a basic warm cam stocker rebuild.

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2016, 11:22:14 AM »
.
Ham Sandwich

Online Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2016, 11:25:54 AM »
.
Ham Sandwich

There will plenty of time for that when i start the cam swap thread  :lmao:

Offline trav68

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2016, 11:54:48 AM »
Isn't your motor full of topshelf goodies and pretty highly strung?

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2016, 12:23:59 PM »
Isn't your motor full of topshelf goodies and pretty highly strung?

 :lmao:

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #7 on: February 17, 2016, 12:25:01 PM »
There will plenty of time for that when i start the cam swap thread  :lmao:

mmm yum...can't wait .  :lmao:

Online Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #8 on: February 17, 2016, 12:47:41 PM »
Isn't your motor full of topshelf goodies and pretty highly strung?

I guess so...

Barnett ?  :lmao: :lmao:

Online GEOFF289

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #9 on: February 17, 2016, 12:57:13 PM »
So does this mean you got no joy from the engine builder over the bronze dizzy gear and are rebuilding it yourself?

Online shaunp

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #10 on: February 17, 2016, 01:02:07 PM »
Comp say you can used Mellonised steel gear now with a roller

Online Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #11 on: February 17, 2016, 01:06:21 PM »
So does this mean you got no joy from the engine builder over the bronze dizzy gear and are rebuilding it yourself?

Yeah, which should be fun  :pepper:


But hey on the bright side i've got you blokes to help, i mean confuse the hell out of me.  :thumb:

What could go wrong  :lmao: :lmao:

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #12 on: February 17, 2016, 01:15:24 PM »
So does this mean you got no joy from the engine builder over the bronze dizzy gear

  . :lmao:


and are rebuilding it yourself?

 .  :lmao:

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #13 on: February 17, 2016, 01:21:22 PM »

Offline trav68

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #14 on: February 17, 2016, 01:24:27 PM »
Up to you mate but I would seriously consider it. With all the knowledgeable guys here you will be fine.

I am an engineer so like to remove any element of error, or guess work, so piston valve check and degree cams. The upside to this general approach is you don't end up on the side of the road..or one of those poor souls at a trackdays parked up with mechanical gremlims by mid morning.

Sounds like you have had a few little dramas so suspect for your own sanity it would be good to go through everything thoroughly sort it once and for all and then you can just enjoy the car for many years to to come problem free.

Trav

Online Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #15 on: February 17, 2016, 09:57:28 PM »
Whats the best way heads on or off ?

I know it can be done either way just wasn't sure.

Offline trav68

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #16 on: February 18, 2016, 11:06:45 AM »
Um, heads on so you can spend money on refreshements not head gaskets.  :cheers:

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #17 on: February 18, 2016, 12:00:40 PM »
Whats the best way heads on or off ?

On.


I know it can be done either way...

Yes, by a qualified mechanic.
.

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #18 on: February 18, 2016, 12:01:10 PM »

Ham Sandwich...



Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #19 on: February 18, 2016, 12:01:33 PM »

with Mustard...

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #20 on: February 18, 2016, 12:03:07 PM »

and pickles...

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #21 on: February 18, 2016, 12:09:03 PM »
.
 :agree:

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #22 on: February 18, 2016, 12:09:45 PM »

Offline barnett468

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #23 on: February 18, 2016, 02:02:54 PM »
CAM REMOVAL OPTION A

Put the car in gear with the parking brake on.

Place something thick on both FRONT fenders to protect them . If you use cloth, put some newspaper on top to keep oil from soaking through . You can also by plain or magnetic fender covers . Supercheap may have them.

Remove the battery and place it on wood, not on the concrete . This will not only give you more elbow room, it will allow you to use the battery tray to put stuff on . Put newspaper on the tray.

Drain the oil then drag a magnet thru it . If you get much metal, it is not a good sign.

Remove the radiator cap then drain the rad fluid.

Remove the radiator.

Remove the radiator fan if it is mechanical.

Remove the fan belts.

Remove the alternator and brackets.

Move the power steering pump and bracket out of the way if you have one.

Remove the valve covers.

Remove the spark plugs.

Remove the water pump.

Remove the lower crank pulley.

Count the number of mounting holes in your pulley then rent a damper pulley with the same number of holes.

Put the car in neutral.

Use a ratchet to turn the damper clockwise as you face the engine until you see the intake valve on the head to the left of you go down then all the way back up . Continue to turn the damper around 1/3 rd of a turn more until the TDC [zero] line lines up with the pointer on the timing cover.

Put the car in gear.

Use a long breaker bar to turn the damper bolt counter clockwise as you face the engine until it is loose, then remove it and the flat washer.

Use the puller and wrench to remove the damper.

Remove the timing pointer.

Remove the timing cover . It might need to be pried on lightly if they used sealer.

Remove the carb linkage and fuel line.

Remove the carb.

Remove the intake manifold.

Remove the rocker nuts one at a time . If they have an allen screw in the center, turn it counter clockwise 1 1/2 turn, then reinstall the nut with 1 turn only.

Move the rocker arms to the side so the push rods are exposed.

Remove all the push rods and put them in a plastic bag.

Remove all the lifters.

Remove the bolt on the cam gear.

Hold the cam gear and pry on it so it only moves 6 mm [1/4"] forward.

Pry the bottom gear so it only moves 10 mm forward.

Pry on the cam gear until it comes off.

Get around a 20 cm [8"] long bolt the same size as the cam bolt.

Screw the bolt into the end of the cam gear around 20 mm.

Pull the cam forward slowly while trying to keep the rear of the cam centered by using leverage on the bolt.

The cam will move around 30 mm at which point the journals will no longer be in the cam bearings . At this point, the cam will be able to flop around . Continue to remove it slowly . When it stops moving, try to center it with the bolt bolt as you gently pull on it until it moves again . The cam may stop several times as you pull on it . This is common.

Inspect the front of the block for metal where the distributor gear was located and clean the area.




Online Fitzy1980

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Re: Do you have to degree a new cam ?
« Reply #24 on: February 18, 2016, 11:04:30 PM »

Yes, by a qualified mechanic.
.

Hurtful  :lmao:

 

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